SESSION 30/MAY/03
Medium: Jorge Olguin.
Entity that came to talk: Johnakan Ur-El.
Interlocutor: In the Gospels it is written that Jesus, in a place called Gethsemane, located on the mount of Olives, he felt sadness and anxiety and dialoguing with the Absolute he said: " Father, if You are willing, remove this cup from Me. Yet not My will, but Yours be done”
Johnakan Ur-El: It was really like that and the words that Jesus pronounced were coherent - in fact he rather monologued instead of dialoguing, because he spoke with words and the Absolute communicated with his causal Body - because he was really with such a great fear, so great fear.
Many asked me, at spiritual level, about this topic - we the Masters of light have many debates -, regarding to why Socrates was so strong when taking the hemlock and he even ended up discussing and teaching some disciples saying: "The one who is to leave this world it’s me not you, and if I have the strength why not you?". Why then the Master Jesus, being so elevated, passing to the plane 5º, suddenly had that apparent lack of courage?- I emphasize apparent-,
The answer is because he was very worn out. Think that depression lowers the subtle vibrations, it makes you restate many things. He had a lot of depression because he knew that of the twelve disciples, only two or three hardly understood him. I myself, embodied in that time as John Zebedee, I didn't understand all his teachings. For these circumstances, Jesus felt very alone and very abandoned. Abandonment welcomes fear, because abandonment somehow produces Ego and it "lowers the defenses", as you now say.
For that reason, in a given moment, a kind of attachment made prey of him. Naturally that the one that finally conquered was his common sense, his depersonalization, his mission. And so it was true the phrase "Father, Yet not My will, but Yours be done”. When everything happened, all that trial, so forged, so full of lies, finally during the crucifixion, he speaks and says to the Father:”Forgive them for they do not know what they do”.
Interlocutor: Were these words pronounced from the cross?
Johnakan Ur-El: Yes, being on the cross, bleeding. He said those words because most of the people were jeering at him, and he was still with tears in his eyes, with tremendous corporal pains, adding the asphyxia, but in spite of that, he kept thinking they didn't understand that he wanted to bring peace. And when he said that children will rise up against their parents, he didn't want to divide the family - they were of so little understanding with regard to parables - but rather he simply referred that they won't agree.
Interlocutor: When Jesus disembodied, Were there tremors, earthquakes, etc., or it’s an entire invention of the evangelists?
Johnakan Ur-El: No, it was not an invention. These events were produced by the same extraterrestrials that later on resurrected him.
Interlocutor: Did they do it for some special reason?
Johnakan Ur-El: They did it to fortify the myth.
Interlocutor: Was it a similar event, as for the purpose, to the alleged voice of God during the Transfiguration?
Johnakan Ur-El: That’s Correct.
Interlocutor: How did they provoke those tremors?
Johnakan Ur-El: In that area of Jerusalem there are caves and the aliens had hidden their ships in them. Instead of having them in the skies, they had them inside the earth.
Interlocutor: Was the mother ship also hidden in some cave?
Johnakan Ur-El: No, the mother ship stayed at a height of 200 or 300 km [124 -186 miles]. Only two exploratory ships were hidden in the caverns. And the tremors were produced by them drilling the land and provoking landslides.
Interlocutor: Weren’t those ships damaged?
Johnakan Ur-El: No, the landslides didn’t cause damage to the ships.
Interlocutor: Let’s see if I understood, at the moment in which Jesus expired, the ships that were hidden in the caves produced landslides and those were the tremors or earthquakes the Bible says?
Johnakan Ur-El: Correct. There is no mystery.
Interlocutor: Should we discard, then, any climatic phenomenon?
Johnakan Ur-El: Totally. The question is very simple, don't look for anything mysterious.
Interlocutor: It is perfectly clear. Jesus had said that in the third day he would resurrect?
Johnakan Ur-El: Yes, he had said that.
Interlocutor: There is something that I don't understand. What about the texts in the Bible where the resurrection was written?
Johnakan Ur-El: Nothing was predicted. They were all inventions.
Interlocutor: How did Jesus know he would be resurrected? Was this discussed in the episode of the Transfiguration where Jesus accepted the resurrection the aliens proposed to him?
Johnakan Ur-El: In fact that is precisely what they spoke about in the Transfiguration. The aliens from Fulgor 5 knew the history of Earth and they also knew that Jesus with his behavior was getting problems inexorably, with the Roman authorities as well as the Jews, and certainly he was going to be killed.
Interlocutor: I believe that even the Master Jesus knew it.
Johnakan Ur-El: Of course he knew it. And his biological mother also knew it, since one year and a half before she had told him: "Son, they are going to kill you". These aliens commented to Jesus that the same radioactive technique with which they had increased his vibrations could also resurrect him.
Interlocutor: Now when Jesus was lowered from the cross, they took him to the tomb and they covered it with a heavy stone. Was Nicodemo one of those that helped, as the Gospels say?
Johnakan Ur-El: That’s right.
Interlocutor: How much would it weigh that stone, 100 or 200 kg?
Johnakan Ur-El: Exactly 300 kilograms. It wasn’t that big either, but two people would not move it.
Interlocutor: According to the Gospel of John, and I believe that also Mathew and Mark, the next day, at dawn, when there was still dark, Mary Magdalene went to the tomb and when seeing the stone rolled away and the tomb empty she thought that somebody had taken the body. When she was there crying, she saw two angels in white and then to Jesus who requests not to be touched. Well I don’t want to detail more about this episode because everybody knows it. What is the truth on this story?
Johnakan Ur-El: The events happened in this way: when Mary Magdalene arrived at the tomb somebody was awaiting for her, not an angel but one of the extraterrestrials that had interviewed Jesus in the episode of the Transfiguration. The stone was rolled away, and this alien was the one who rolled it away so that she sees that Jesus was not there.
Interlocutor: I suppose that he used some artifact.
Johnakan Ur-El: Obviously. It was an anti-gravitational artifact.
Interlocutor: Anyway among all the events about the resurrection those that intrigue me more have to do with the appearances of Jesus.
Johnakan Ur-El: First of all, it is necessary to clarify that Jesus had been covered with a shroud, and the same radioactive technique that had resurrected him was the one that impregnated in negative his silhouette, with his blood, his wounds of his hands, his feet, those of his forehead and his side. Notice that the wounds of his hands made by the nails were not on his palms but in his wrists.
Interlocutor: Yes, I knew this fact of the crucifixion, because if a person was hung with the nails inserted in the palms of his hands, the weight of the body would make it fall to the ground.
Johnakan Ur-El: Sure, and for that reason the paintings where you see the wounds in the palms of his hands are wrong. Besides, in the shroud the wound that Longinus made when he pierced him on his side with a lance is very clear. And they are also perceived a series of wounds in the forehead where they had nailed him the thorns.
Interlocutor: Did the aliens resurrect Jesus directly in the tomb or they took him to the ship?
Johnakan Ur-El: No, he was not taken to the ship. They brought the artifacts to the tomb and he was resurrected directly there. If they had taken him to the ship, the shroud wouln’t have been impregnated with radiation.
Interlocutor: I understand. In one of the gospels it’s written that the shroud was wrapped up in one place.
Johnakan Ur-El: The shroud was not wrapped up, but simply put it aside.
Interlocutor: At some moment was Jesus dematerialized in order to take him to the ship?
Johnakan Ur-El: Yes, after he was resurrected. But not only was he dematerialized, but also all the aliens that collaborated in his resurrection.
Interlocutor: Is it correct to call it teletransportatión?
Johnakan Ur-El: Yes that is the correct term.
Interlocutor: Were the appearances of Jesus in astral form, holographic projection or he show up in person?
Johnakan Ur-El: It was in the last two ways, not astrally. The Master appeared many times, in both ways.
Interlocutor: According to the Bible, Jesus spoke in each one of his appearances.
Johnakan Ur-El: The answer is that, even being a holographic projection, Jesus could speak.
Interlocutor: When Jesus appeared through a holographic projection was it difficult to be recognized? I ask it because in the Bible, I don't remember in which Gospel, it was said that they didn't recognize him, at least at the first sight.
Johnakan Ur-El: Don't forget that a holographic projection, although it depicted Jesus perfectly, it didn't stop from being transparent and that hindered the immediate reecognition.
Interlocutor: Then Jesus was seen like a ghost?
Johnakan Ur-El: Sure, he was seen in that way.
Interlocutor: What was the reason Jesus told them that they could not come closer to him?
Johnakan Ur-El: In fact, he said that to avoid all possibility that they discovered that it was not him, but rather a projected image. Besides if they had touched it, the impression would have been tremendous. That kind of projection has no comparison with what is made at the moment on Earth, because its energy was very great and with the three dimensions very real. Add to this fact that if one had put his hand inside of it, he would have ended up feeling something, with a sensation of being touching something lighter than water, similar to very dense air, and it would also have produced a kind of buzzing that would have terrified them literally. This conjunction of things made that the Master warned them wisely.
Interlocutor: In the Bible it is written that Jesus, after appearing and staying for a while, he disappeared suddenly. I suppose that the device that was projecting the image from the ship was turned off.
Johnakan Ur-El: Yes, it was like that.
Interlocutor: I also suppose that Jesus spoke from the ship and the holographic projection of the figure also spoke.
Johnakan Ur-El: Yes, because the holographic projection also included the voice.
Interlocutor: On the Earth Will we have something similar?
Johnakan Ur-El: Remotely similar. There is holographic projection, but not so sophisticated because the images tend to fade away. Besides, they have not yet achieved the projection of the oral sound.
Interlocutor: And to whom he appeared in person?
Johnakan Ur-El: He appeared to all of his disciples. Even an anecdote happened that I relate as John where Peter asked Jesus: “Will you return?" and he said: "I’ll send the comforting Spirit”. When saying this, the Master meant that the Spirit of the Absolute is always with all of us, as consolation, as learning, as mercy. This was very difficult to understand, because even the apostles wanted more concrete things. Besides, Peter was jealous and he always tried to compete with me incarnated as John. Being me young, with eighteen years old of physical life old, he said: "And what of this one?”[1] That is to say he was always asking about on me underestimating me, because he wanted to be the favorite and then he was jealous of me. The Master had patience so, but so big!
Interlocutor: In the Bible it is written that he appeared before two disciples who went to a village called Emmaus, one of them named Cleopas. They invited him to eat and when broke the loaf, and gave to them. Is this episode real? I mean if he appeared in physical body.
Johnakan Ur-El: Yes, the episode is real, and he appeared with his physical body and he ate with them.
Interlocutor: All the times the Bible mentions that Jesus appeared and ate with his disciples are real?
Johnakan Ur-El: Yes, because he was present physically.
Interlocutor: And how did he do to disappear? Because, according to the Bible, the Master didn't leave through the door, but rather he suddenly disappeared.
Johnakan Ur-El: When it was a holographic projection, he disappeared when the broadcasting concluded, and when he was physically present, he disappeared because he was teletransported to the ship. The Master, obviously had already agreed with the aliens so when he gave a sign with an artifact he had in his wrist, he was directly transferred to the ship.
Interlocutor: The episode with Thomas who said: “Unless I shall see the print of the nails in His hands, and put my finger into the print of the nails, and thrust my hand into His side, I will not believe” Was it real?
Johnakan Ur-El: Yes, it was real. Obviously, Jesus was in his physical body, otherwise Thomas would not have been able to put his fingers in the wounds.
Interlocutor: But Why the extraterrestrial, who resurrected him didn’t heal him those wound also?
Johnakan Ur-El: He was cured of many wounds, even of some deteriorated organs. But with regard to the wounds of his wrist he left them in that way so that they could be seen. The Master didn't want his wrists to be cured because it was going to be a very important factor of credibility.
Interlocutor: In the holographic projections Did those wounds also appear?
Johnakan Ur-El: Yes, perfectly. Don't forget that a holographic projection shows the body as it is, because it is like a picture. And what is in the original also appears in the copy.
Interlocutor: I understand. Did Jesus also appear in the sea of Tiberias and he ate with his disciples?
Johnakan Ur-El: Yes, it is also a real fact.
Interlocutor: Now then, I understand that the resurrection of Jesus by the aliens was not something planned from the spiritual planes, that is to say, before the embodiment of the Master. Is it correct?
Johnakan Ur-El: Yes, it was not something premeditated.
Interlocutor: Actually, I mean another aspect of the question.
Johnakan Ur-El: I understand what you want to ask perfectly. Notice that the base of religion let us call it Catholic Apostolic, so dependent of miracles; it is the resurrection of the flesh. I speak in a so negative way because the true spiritual paths are based on the Service and they don't need miracles. But notice that the resurrection of Jesus by extraterrestrials was nothing more and nothing less than an "accident", so to speak. If that intervention had not existed, the resurrection of the flesh would not have existed. Then maybe Jesus wouldn’t have had much transcendence in the physical plane as he had it.
Interlocutor: In mean exactly that. The Master Jesus took advantage of the fact that he was resurrected to strengthen his image and therefore his teachings?
Johnakan Ur-El: Yes, of course.
Interlocutor: Now then, the Master Jesus also told to his disciples, so that they believed more in him that he was the only son of God. From my viewpoint, I consider that these things were valid for that time. What about his projection to the future, where we still believe that Jesus is God made flesh and that he was resurrected miraculously? Aren’t those statements of Jesus something counterproductive?
Johnakan Ur-El: There was no other way. His performance had to be grandiloquent, pompous; otherwise they wouldn’t have listened to him as they listened. Nor would he have transcended in the way he did.
Interlocutor: Then, Is it clear that what Jesus said is not questionable at all?
Johnakan Ur-El: Absolutely. Anyway, when the Master said: “He who has seen me has seen the Father” he is saying that who makes my same actions of Service, will see the Father.
Interlocutor: I understand. In an opportunity I asked directly to the Master Jesus if those words had a double interpretation and he clarified me that they didn’t, and that he said those words so that they believed that he was really the Father.
Johnakan Ur-El: But he said it with good reason, because his purpose was to get that reverence, which was so necessary for his mission!
Interlocutor: Was The crucifixion of Jesus a result so that his image be projected with more power in the future? I ask it because it is obvious that if Jesus had not been crucified his teachings wouldn’t have had so much transcendence.
Johnakan Ur-El: In fact, the crucifixion was not something so sought. It was one of the most likely outcomes. Besides, the Master didn't ignore that if his mission continued in the way he was making it, at some point, as you say, “the quarrel would start". And those who took branches of palm trees, were the same ones who later on turned their backs on him.
Interlocutor: In some book I read something about that, I believe it was one written by Alice Bailey where points that to Jesus the crucifixion implied a certain initiation, I believe it was the sixth, or something like that. What is the truth about this?
Johnakan Ur-El: It is one of the so many things that have been said. It doesn't make any sense. Besides, the symbol of the cross didn't exist since Jesus carried only a gigantic log that only formed a cross when they put a crosspiece. It was a way of execution the Romans have, but it could have been also logs with shape of “X” or “Y” and it would have been the same thing.
Interlocutor: I understand. How was the act of crucifixion?
Johnakan Ur-El: First, they nailed the logs, later on they tied the Master with big ropes and then they nailed him.
Interlocutor: In that time they used to put in the crotch of those crucified a wooden chunk, in that way the asphyxia was prevented prolonging the torture. Did they make it with Jesus also?
Johnakan Ur-El: No, the Master was directly nailed in his feet below of what you call the shinbones, with a single nail, and in the hands through his wrists.
Interlocutor: Did the thieves, who were crucified with Jesus, speak something with the Master? Was it true there were a good thief and a bad thief? Did they insult him as some authors say?
Johnakan Ur-El: No, nothing of that is true, on the contrary. Both of them had a tremendous reverence to the Master. They took him, as many in that time, as the direct son of God. They thought that Jesus was the same God revived.
Interlocutor: But did they say something to Jesus?
Johnakan Ur-El: They told him that he had pity on them. And the Master, knowing that they would go directly to the plane 2 because of their misdeeds they had made: violations, robberies, and a lot of things more - precisely for that reason they had been crucified -, in that moment he told them that they would go to the Kingdom of Heaven with him. With this he wanted to encourage them in that moment so painful moment, but he also knew that then they would think it over and they will almost immediately rise to the plane 3.
Interlocutor: Moving on to another topic, since we have few minutes left of session, Where this issue about the Holy Ghost appeared? We know that it is false. Did Jesus speak of this entity?
Johnakan Ur-El: Jesus spoke of the Comforting Spirit who is no other that the Spirit of God, the one that comfort us when we, in the plan 5º have pain for other beings who are in the densest planes, or you, incarnated, due to different things that you don’t’ concrete.
Interlocutor: Then, the famous "Trinity", Father, Son and Holy Ghost. Is it an entire invention?
Johnakan Ur-El: It is an invention. The Holy Ghost doesn't exist as a third person, and all of us are children of God also. Only if you understand the Holy Ghost as the Spirit of God, then it is fine.
Interlocutor: I understood perfectly. In the Bible it is written that the disciples doubted that Jesus was resurrected really.
Johnakan Ur-El: They only doubted when it was a holographic projection, but when he appeared with his physical body they didn’t doubt. Otherwise they wouldn’t’ have accepted him so easily. Obviously, he was haggard but his beard looked trimmed by the same aliens. Keep in mind that in that time there were no tools to trim the beard. When the aliens resurrected him, they applied makeup on him and they groomed him as if he were a movie actor. That is to say that he was not as disheveled as he was before, but he was recognized.
Interlocutor: What did it happen to the spirit of Jesus when he disembodied?
Johnakan Ur-El: Once disincarnated that is to say, being already a 100% spirit, he took advantage to go to the Eighth Sphere. One of his missions was to feel, to perceive the feelings of the spirits that had lowered to that place. It is something similar as if at this time your physical part, your 10% meets with a crowd and then you open up your arms trying to feel everybody, to feel all of them, as if the tips of your fingers could feel the thoughts of everyone. Obviously I am speaking in a metaphoric way.
When Jesus lowered to the Eighth Sphere, it was like he opened up his conceptual arms, that is to say all his spiritual concept, to feel and try to talk, but it was a dialogue of the deaf. Translating the concepts to words, forcing the interpretation because in fact the spiritual concepts are untranslatable.
He told them: - "What is happening with you?", And the answer was something similar as if somebody took you of the lapel and answered "Help me!" -But tell me what is happening to you!, Jesus insisted. From the other side they didn't respond the reasons, because they wanted a solution at once. Then Jesus went to another spirit and he asked the same question: - Tell me what is happening to you shares your pain with me! -, and the answer was always the same: --“I don’t want to share anything; I want you to alleviate me now!” It was a "dialogue of the deaf."
If there was some teaching that Jesus learnt from the eighth Sphere when he lowered there, it was the tremendous, monumental Ego that there is in that plane due to the same suffering. The spirits don't have ears, or eyes, or mouth, but it was as if they had them. For that reason I say that it was a dialogue of the deaf, of blind and of mute. Practically nobody listens to the other there, and all of them are plunged into their own pain. A similar example to what happens to the spirits in the Eighth Sphere, you can see it in the movies where people try to escape when there is a bombardment, they run away side crashing with each other. That is to say, not all of them go in the same direction like those giant ants called “Marabunta” [2] that you will surely have seen in many movies.
Interlocutor: Yes, I have seen them.
Johnakan Ur-El: And in the physical plane, when there is an earthquake, a bombardment or some catastrophe, the human beings escape everywhere. Well, imagine that increased to the umpteenth power and you will have a view of what the Eighth Sphere is.
Interlocutor: I understood perfectly. How is the vessel to continue?
Johnakan Ur-El: He is very destabilized.
Interlocutor: Then I will ask the rest of the questions in the next session.
Johnakan Ur-El: I leave all my Light to you.
Interlocutor: See you later, Master, and thank you.
SESSION - 03/MAY/1998
Medium: Jorge R. Olguin
Entity that came to talk: Johnakan Ur-El
Interlocutor: See you later, Master, and thank you... Who will come now?
Johnakan Ur-El: I am like hovering; the place is like loaded... I Am Johnakan Ur-El. I want to transmit the following thing: there was a civilization that practically lacked of faith, agnostic; they didn't have any spiritual leader, in a world empty of faith, ideas and philosophy.
Permission was requested to the Great Logos of that time - I am speaking of the time my Master was crucified – in order to resurrect him. That permission was given and he was resurrected.
There was no time to prepare him, because that planet, called Fulgor V, was entering already in agony and he was taken to that world so that he transmits messages. He was during a lapse what you would call months, transmitting spiritual messages in that world.
It was about a non compatible orb, maybe, to the substance my Master was made of. Let us remember that the Master's body, just like the one of all us when we are embodied was basically made of carbon... He went to a world where the base was silicon and this world was impregnated with radioactivity.
Then, the Master knew that he had little lifespan. The inhabitants of that world also knew it...
Interlocutor: Did he go to that world, then, with his own physical body?
Johnakan Ur-El: Correct, with the his own body, on purpose to demonstrate to the inhabitants of that world that he didn't fear physical death. Because he could have argued: "Since I was resurrected, I can continue on Earth."
To my Master they let him choose, whether to take that mission or not, because when taking that mission, in such incompatible world to his physical body, he knew that he had a lifespan from 6 to 8 terrestrial months nothing else.
Interlocutor: But the Master Jesus appeared before his disciples on his physical body?
Johnakan Ur-El: Yes, he appeared in physical body, but only once - there are many mistakes about it -, moments before traveling to that dying world. He appeared and he was eating with us. I embodied as John Zebedee in that time was the first to see him.
Interlocutor: But he appeared many times in his astral body?
Johnakan Ur-El: Correct, and for that reason the Master didn't allow that they touch him. Although I’m not interested to highlight this now, but the fact that he opted to travel to that world, in which his physical life would fade away to the end of 6 to 8 months due to the enormous radioactivity there was, not compatible with his organism of carbon, not compatible with the silicon life that there was in that planet...
In that world he gave messages... Very incredulous people... Very similar to us but from another vibration, until the few philosophers who were in that planet make them understand that if a being from another world comes to preach, and they know that that being doesn't want to be isolated, protected, it is because those messages are truth.
Interlocutor: What was the result of his preach?
Johnakan Ur-El: He ended up converting millions of beings within a lapse of less than six months. That is to say that in fact he achieved, in much less time, the same mission that here on Earth he made in two years and three months. There he achieve it in little less than six months.
Interlocutor: Really amazing!
Johnakan Ur-El: In that world where the beings are made of silicon, they also have the Master Jesus as a spiritual avatar. The Master Jesus disincarnated in that world affected by radiation. It was an enormous merit to have completed that mission, as big as the one that he had on this planet, and automatically he is named Planetary Logos.
Therefore, It is extremely commendable the work of the Master Jesus, because he didn't give his life on the cross for all those who live on this planet, but he also gave his life for people he didn’t even know, with other customs.
Interlocutor: This has been totally clarified. See you later, Johnakan, and thank you.
[1] John 21.21
[2] The name army ant (or legionary ant or "Marabunta") is applied to over 200 ant species (Wikipedia)
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